Yesterday I quoted an email that had gone out recently from the Elijah list (a Third Wave Charismatic revival prophecy list). You can find it here if you haven't read it - or scroll down to the next post.
Can You Spot It?
The answer is:
Muslim is NOT a Christian denomination. And frankly, neither is Roman Catholicism, if you believe R.C. Sproul's recent talk to the Together4God conference as recorded by Tim Challies. You can read that HERE. Frankly, I tend to agree with R.C. I know that will seem very narrow minded and perhaps even cruel to some of you. But I do hope you will read what R.C. said before jumping all over me. I am talking of course about the Catholic theology, not dissing Catholic people as persons. But we do need to clarify wht being justified by God really means; not jsut what we "feel" it is or want it to be.
Sunday, April 30, 2006
Saturday, April 29, 2006
Can You Spot It?
Have you ever done those puzzles? - the ones where you look at a picture and ty to spot what's wrong with it. Sometimes it will be a person with three ears, or an upside down store sign - things like that. Well, let's play that game now.
What's wrong with this?(Answer tomorrow)
We need to see all people as created in the image of God, and that He loves them all, and that He wants them all to come to Him as their Father. Alistair Petrie wrote a book called the Sacred Trust. In the book, He looked at the world from an incredible perspective. Rather than throwing stones at systems that may not appeal to each of us, he saw the beauty and strength in different denominations and different people groups and races:
Baptists - Gift of teaching about Salvation
Methodists/Presbyterians/United - Gift of teaching about social issues
Pentecostals - Gift of teaching about the power of God and the Holy Spirit
Nazarenes - Gift of teaching on holiness
Roman Catholics - Gift of teaching on Authority and the (Righteous) fear of God
Anglicans - Gift of teaching the balance of the Word and Liturgy
Mennonites - Gift of teaching on reconciliation
Blacks - Gift of the longsuffering nature of God
Hispanics - Gift of the family of God
Whites - Gift of the aspect in authority
Native Indians - Gift of being spiritual warriors and the work of the Holy Spirit
Muslims - Gift of the fear of the Lord (we need to be willing to give our very lives to the Lord--Muslims love their lives not unto death for their god)
....from Richard Ricciardelli: "A Revolution Of Unity"
(from the Elijah list)
What's wrong with this?(Answer tomorrow)
We need to see all people as created in the image of God, and that He loves them all, and that He wants them all to come to Him as their Father. Alistair Petrie wrote a book called the Sacred Trust. In the book, He looked at the world from an incredible perspective. Rather than throwing stones at systems that may not appeal to each of us, he saw the beauty and strength in different denominations and different people groups and races:
Baptists - Gift of teaching about Salvation
Methodists/Presbyterians/United - Gift of teaching about social issues
Pentecostals - Gift of teaching about the power of God and the Holy Spirit
Nazarenes - Gift of teaching on holiness
Roman Catholics - Gift of teaching on Authority and the (Righteous) fear of God
Anglicans - Gift of teaching the balance of the Word and Liturgy
Mennonites - Gift of teaching on reconciliation
Blacks - Gift of the longsuffering nature of God
Hispanics - Gift of the family of God
Whites - Gift of the aspect in authority
Native Indians - Gift of being spiritual warriors and the work of the Holy Spirit
Muslims - Gift of the fear of the Lord (we need to be willing to give our very lives to the Lord--Muslims love their lives not unto death for their god)
....from Richard Ricciardelli: "A Revolution Of Unity"
(from the Elijah list)
Friday, April 28, 2006
Will the Real Jesus Please Stand Up?
After reading this from David Kirkwood, I realized what it was that was bothering me so much about the emergents. Their Jesus is a man. Mine is the God-man; Son of God who went to the cross and took my sins, was resurrected and now sits in heaven at the right hand of God.
The last paragraph might bother some. I think, at least I hope, he means that our faith has to be in the right Jesus, not that we aren't saved by faith. But since I don't know Mr. Kirkwood, I don't know that is what he means. But what I just explained is what I mean.
AMERICAN IDOL
Imagine a person taking a block of wood and carving it to look like a bearded man in a robe. At the bottom of his wooden figurine, he carves the name "Jesus." Finally, each day he bows before it in worship. Does that make him a Christian?
No, that makes him an idolater. He is worshipping something that he has named Jesus but who is not Jesus at all. His wooden god is a grave insult to Jesus.
In a similar fashion, modern American Christendom has created many versions of Jesus that hardly resemble the Jesus who is revealed in Scripture. Having created a god to their own liking, those who worship "American Jesus" are no less idolatrous and no more Christian than the woodcarver I've just described.
What are the differences between American Jesus and Bible Jesus? American Jesus comes in many varieties, but let's compare a few of the attributes of the most popular versions with Bible Jesus.
Bible Jesus said that only those who do the will of His Father, keeping His commandments, will enter the kingdom of heaven. All others will be cast into hell, even those who called Him their Lord (see Matt. 7:13-27). Bible Jesus warned that the hateful, the lustful, the unforgiving, the selfish and greedy would not saved (Matt. 5:21-22, 27-30; 6:14-15, 19-24; 25:31-46).
By contrast, American Jesus doesn't stress holiness nearly so much. He certainly never says that obedience is essential for one to gain eternal life. Those who believe that are legalists, he says. He is always stressing God's grace, but it is a grace that overlooks and forgives yet doesn't transform. American Jesus believes that faith without works can save and that there is an entire class of heaven-bound believers called "carnal Christians" who are indistinguishable from unsaved people.
Using unmistakable terms, Bible Jesus warned His closest disciples of the possibility of their not being ready for His return if they returned to sin.
He warned those closest disciples that they would be cast into hell if they weren't ready when He returned
(Matt. 24:32-51; 25:1-30).
American Jesus, on the other hand, believes that once you are saved you will always be saved. You are guaranteed a place in heaven regardless of how you live your life. He often tells his audiences that he died for all their sins, past, present and future, and so there is no sin that they can commit for which he didn't die.
So they are quite safe in his grace. (No one ever seems to ask if that means that everyone will be saved in the end, since Jesus died for everyone's sins, past, present and future.)
Bible Jesus, not knowing the time of His return, told His followers that they might well need to run for the hills because of the great tribulation which would arise at the time that the antichrist would enter the Jerusalem temple. Some of them would be martyred. He promised that after cataclysmic events, He would "send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other"
(Matt. 24:3-36).
American Jesus promises that all his own will be taken up to heaven before any tribulation begins, because surely God would not allow the people he loves to be so persecuted. (Those who believe in American Jesus often have little idea of how much persecution is being endured around the world by those who believe in Bible Jesus. Neither do they care.) American Jesus will return twice, and His second return will follow His first return by seven years. He forgot to tell his disciples about this.
Bible Jesus commanded His followers to sell their possessions, give to charity, and lay up treasures in heaven. He commanded them not to lay up treasures on earth. He said that those who do are full of darkness (see Matt. 6:19-24; Luke 12:33). Even those who scrupulously tithe, like the scribes and Pharisees, could be lovers of money (see Luke 11:42; 16:14; 18:12).
American Jesus often tells his followers just the opposite. He wants to give them more treasures to lay up on earth and make them even richer than they already are. He promises prosperity for just 10% of their income. Interestingly, according to pollster George Barna, no more than 8% of the people who believe in American Jesus actually do give at least 10% of their income to his cause.
Bible Jesus taught His disciples to pray that His Father's name would be hallowed, that His kingdom would come and His will would be perfectly done on earth. He taught them to make request for their daily bread and for deliverance from evil (see Matt. 6:9-13).
American Jesus teaches his disciples to pray the prayer of Jabez and to claim their covenant rights to gain more wealth.
Bible Jesus told everyone to repent, and warned them if they didn't they would perish. He declared that repentance was a requirement for forgiveness (see Matt. 4:17; Luke 5:32, 13:3-5; 24:47).
American Jesus rarely mentions repentance. He most often just asks people to accept him as savior.
Bible Jesus often spoke about hell and warned of its terrors (see
Matt. 5:2, 29-30; 8:12; 10:28; 13:41-42, 49-50; 18:9; 22:13; 23:33;
24:51; 25:30; Luke 13:28).
American Jesus doesn't want to scare anyone by mentioning hell, as it might offend people who are going to hell, and that hinders church growth.
Bible Jesus told His ministers that their goal was to make disciples who would obey all of His commandments (see Matt. 28:19-20).
American Jesus tells his ministers that their goal is to gather the largest possible crowds on Sunday mornings.
Bible Jesus promised freedom from sin to those who would become His true disciples and abide in His Word (see John 8:31-36).
American Jesus makes no such promises. Sinners and addicts must wait until heaven for any hope of freedom. American Jesus does offer psychological counseling and support groups.
Bible Jesus believed that being a believer in Him and being His disciple were synonymous. He called everyone to take the first step in a relationship with Him by becoming His committed disciple (see Matt. 28:19-20; Luke 14:25-35; John 8:30-31).
American Jesus believes one can be a heaven-bound believer even if he never becomes a disciple, which is an optional step for believers who really want to commit themselves to him.
Bible Jesus calls for passionate devotion. He declared that we are not worthy of Him if we love our parents or our children more than Him. We can't come after Him unless we deny ourselves and take up our cross (see Matt. 10:37-38; 16:24).
American Jesus doesn't mind taking second place to more exciting things like football, NASCAR and WWF.
The chief difference between Bible Jesus and American Jesus is this: Bible Jesus is King of kings and Lord of lords, almighty Son of God, and soon-coming Judge of all, whereas American Jesus is only savior and friend. The chief difference between those who believe in Bible Jesus and those who believe in American Jesus is this: Those who believe in Bible Jesus obey His commandments and love the brethren (see 1 John 2:3-6; 3:9-10, 14), while those who believe in American Jesus possess a thin veneer of holiness and don't care about the brethren. In fact, they often hate and criticize Jesus' true followers, calling them "unbalanced fanatics" or "legalists" or "holier-than-thous" (see 1 John 2:9, 11, 19; 3:14; 4:20).
But here is the most sobering fact: People are saved, not when they believe that salvation is by faith, but when they believe in a person, a divine person named Jesus Christ (see John 3:16). That being so, it ought to concern us when so many people who claim to be Christians believe in a Jesus who is so vastly different from Bible Jesus. People who believe in American Jesus actually don't believe in Jesus at all. American Jesus is an American idol.
"When the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth?"
—Jesus (Luke 18:8).
The last paragraph might bother some. I think, at least I hope, he means that our faith has to be in the right Jesus, not that we aren't saved by faith. But since I don't know Mr. Kirkwood, I don't know that is what he means. But what I just explained is what I mean.
AMERICAN IDOL
Imagine a person taking a block of wood and carving it to look like a bearded man in a robe. At the bottom of his wooden figurine, he carves the name "Jesus." Finally, each day he bows before it in worship. Does that make him a Christian?
No, that makes him an idolater. He is worshipping something that he has named Jesus but who is not Jesus at all. His wooden god is a grave insult to Jesus.
In a similar fashion, modern American Christendom has created many versions of Jesus that hardly resemble the Jesus who is revealed in Scripture. Having created a god to their own liking, those who worship "American Jesus" are no less idolatrous and no more Christian than the woodcarver I've just described.
What are the differences between American Jesus and Bible Jesus? American Jesus comes in many varieties, but let's compare a few of the attributes of the most popular versions with Bible Jesus.
Bible Jesus said that only those who do the will of His Father, keeping His commandments, will enter the kingdom of heaven. All others will be cast into hell, even those who called Him their Lord (see Matt. 7:13-27). Bible Jesus warned that the hateful, the lustful, the unforgiving, the selfish and greedy would not saved (Matt. 5:21-22, 27-30; 6:14-15, 19-24; 25:31-46).
By contrast, American Jesus doesn't stress holiness nearly so much. He certainly never says that obedience is essential for one to gain eternal life. Those who believe that are legalists, he says. He is always stressing God's grace, but it is a grace that overlooks and forgives yet doesn't transform. American Jesus believes that faith without works can save and that there is an entire class of heaven-bound believers called "carnal Christians" who are indistinguishable from unsaved people.
Using unmistakable terms, Bible Jesus warned His closest disciples of the possibility of their not being ready for His return if they returned to sin.
He warned those closest disciples that they would be cast into hell if they weren't ready when He returned
(Matt. 24:32-51; 25:1-30).
American Jesus, on the other hand, believes that once you are saved you will always be saved. You are guaranteed a place in heaven regardless of how you live your life. He often tells his audiences that he died for all their sins, past, present and future, and so there is no sin that they can commit for which he didn't die.
So they are quite safe in his grace. (No one ever seems to ask if that means that everyone will be saved in the end, since Jesus died for everyone's sins, past, present and future.)
Bible Jesus, not knowing the time of His return, told His followers that they might well need to run for the hills because of the great tribulation which would arise at the time that the antichrist would enter the Jerusalem temple. Some of them would be martyred. He promised that after cataclysmic events, He would "send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other"
(Matt. 24:3-36).
American Jesus promises that all his own will be taken up to heaven before any tribulation begins, because surely God would not allow the people he loves to be so persecuted. (Those who believe in American Jesus often have little idea of how much persecution is being endured around the world by those who believe in Bible Jesus. Neither do they care.) American Jesus will return twice, and His second return will follow His first return by seven years. He forgot to tell his disciples about this.
Bible Jesus commanded His followers to sell their possessions, give to charity, and lay up treasures in heaven. He commanded them not to lay up treasures on earth. He said that those who do are full of darkness (see Matt. 6:19-24; Luke 12:33). Even those who scrupulously tithe, like the scribes and Pharisees, could be lovers of money (see Luke 11:42; 16:14; 18:12).
American Jesus often tells his followers just the opposite. He wants to give them more treasures to lay up on earth and make them even richer than they already are. He promises prosperity for just 10% of their income. Interestingly, according to pollster George Barna, no more than 8% of the people who believe in American Jesus actually do give at least 10% of their income to his cause.
Bible Jesus taught His disciples to pray that His Father's name would be hallowed, that His kingdom would come and His will would be perfectly done on earth. He taught them to make request for their daily bread and for deliverance from evil (see Matt. 6:9-13).
American Jesus teaches his disciples to pray the prayer of Jabez and to claim their covenant rights to gain more wealth.
Bible Jesus told everyone to repent, and warned them if they didn't they would perish. He declared that repentance was a requirement for forgiveness (see Matt. 4:17; Luke 5:32, 13:3-5; 24:47).
American Jesus rarely mentions repentance. He most often just asks people to accept him as savior.
Bible Jesus often spoke about hell and warned of its terrors (see
Matt. 5:2, 29-30; 8:12; 10:28; 13:41-42, 49-50; 18:9; 22:13; 23:33;
24:51; 25:30; Luke 13:28).
American Jesus doesn't want to scare anyone by mentioning hell, as it might offend people who are going to hell, and that hinders church growth.
Bible Jesus told His ministers that their goal was to make disciples who would obey all of His commandments (see Matt. 28:19-20).
American Jesus tells his ministers that their goal is to gather the largest possible crowds on Sunday mornings.
Bible Jesus promised freedom from sin to those who would become His true disciples and abide in His Word (see John 8:31-36).
American Jesus makes no such promises. Sinners and addicts must wait until heaven for any hope of freedom. American Jesus does offer psychological counseling and support groups.
Bible Jesus believed that being a believer in Him and being His disciple were synonymous. He called everyone to take the first step in a relationship with Him by becoming His committed disciple (see Matt. 28:19-20; Luke 14:25-35; John 8:30-31).
American Jesus believes one can be a heaven-bound believer even if he never becomes a disciple, which is an optional step for believers who really want to commit themselves to him.
Bible Jesus calls for passionate devotion. He declared that we are not worthy of Him if we love our parents or our children more than Him. We can't come after Him unless we deny ourselves and take up our cross (see Matt. 10:37-38; 16:24).
American Jesus doesn't mind taking second place to more exciting things like football, NASCAR and WWF.
The chief difference between Bible Jesus and American Jesus is this: Bible Jesus is King of kings and Lord of lords, almighty Son of God, and soon-coming Judge of all, whereas American Jesus is only savior and friend. The chief difference between those who believe in Bible Jesus and those who believe in American Jesus is this: Those who believe in Bible Jesus obey His commandments and love the brethren (see 1 John 2:3-6; 3:9-10, 14), while those who believe in American Jesus possess a thin veneer of holiness and don't care about the brethren. In fact, they often hate and criticize Jesus' true followers, calling them "unbalanced fanatics" or "legalists" or "holier-than-thous" (see 1 John 2:9, 11, 19; 3:14; 4:20).
But here is the most sobering fact: People are saved, not when they believe that salvation is by faith, but when they believe in a person, a divine person named Jesus Christ (see John 3:16). That being so, it ought to concern us when so many people who claim to be Christians believe in a Jesus who is so vastly different from Bible Jesus. People who believe in American Jesus actually don't believe in Jesus at all. American Jesus is an American idol.
"When the Son of Man comes, will He find faith on the earth?"
—Jesus (Luke 18:8).
Thursday, April 27, 2006
Control is Good?
Third Wave "prophet" Rick Joyner writes,
Restraints and controls are a good thing for this age and will actually be how the Kingdom age begins. However, the goal of the Kingdom is to not need any restraints. Everyone will have it in their hearts to do the right thing because all will be ruled by love. It will take a thousand years to get there. The Lord will rule with a rod of iron at first, even smashing many things that nations have been built on. Some of that smashing will have taken place before His return when everything that can be shaken will be shaken in preparation for the coming Kingdom.....
(Source: http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word/3948)
This is interesting to me as I have studied control and copendency now for over 25 years. You can see a summary of my thoughts at my website, The Faustian Covenant. I've studied control in the home, the workplace, the church and in governments. The minute I read the above Joyner quote, I realized that it sounded vaguely familiar. "Oh yes," I thought. "Now I remember. That's socialist-communism." Here is what Marx, with subtle additions and changes by Lenin, thought about a country's ideal progress.
First, there is a revolution of the worker bees (the proletariat) against the bourgoise (the government leaders, buisness leaders and landowners).
Second, there is a period called socialism in which the new government of the proletariat gobbles up private property, throws leaders out of position, and organizes a central beaucracy-economy. This is suposed to last seven years.
Third, after seven years, the country magically passes into the perfect communist state where everyone is happy because they are doing what they ought to or want to. The difference isn't always clear.
Sounds a lot like Joyner's piece doesn't it. But did it work like that in the Soviet Union?
Here is what actually happened:
1917 - The Revolution of the proletariet against the bourgoise.
1924 - Seven years later, the ideal communist state was supposed to start. But it
didn't. Instead more and more control was instituted. Reasons given:
"WWI/the White Russians are fighting us."
1931 - Seven years later, still no ideal state. Reasons given:
"We still have lots of enemies lurking about and also there is a Great
Depression going on."
1938 - Seven years later, still no ideal state. More control. Reasons given:
Hitler might invade us. We have to prepare."
1945 - Seven years later, still no ideal state. Lots fo control. Reasons given:
"Our country is devasted because of WWII and we have to rebuild."
1952 - 1987 - Five sets of seven years later, still no ideal state. Reasons given:
"We are in a cold war with the United States."
1987 - Finally the people saw the problem after 10 seven-year cycles (70 years). They had been lied to by their leaders.
I wonder what will happen when the Third Wave followers discover they've been lied to as a reason for the excessive control.
Restraints and controls are a good thing for this age and will actually be how the Kingdom age begins. However, the goal of the Kingdom is to not need any restraints. Everyone will have it in their hearts to do the right thing because all will be ruled by love. It will take a thousand years to get there. The Lord will rule with a rod of iron at first, even smashing many things that nations have been built on. Some of that smashing will have taken place before His return when everything that can be shaken will be shaken in preparation for the coming Kingdom.....
(Source: http://www.elijahlist.com/words/display_word/3948)
This is interesting to me as I have studied control and copendency now for over 25 years. You can see a summary of my thoughts at my website, The Faustian Covenant. I've studied control in the home, the workplace, the church and in governments. The minute I read the above Joyner quote, I realized that it sounded vaguely familiar. "Oh yes," I thought. "Now I remember. That's socialist-communism." Here is what Marx, with subtle additions and changes by Lenin, thought about a country's ideal progress.
First, there is a revolution of the worker bees (the proletariat) against the bourgoise (the government leaders, buisness leaders and landowners).
Second, there is a period called socialism in which the new government of the proletariat gobbles up private property, throws leaders out of position, and organizes a central beaucracy-economy. This is suposed to last seven years.
Third, after seven years, the country magically passes into the perfect communist state where everyone is happy because they are doing what they ought to or want to. The difference isn't always clear.
Sounds a lot like Joyner's piece doesn't it. But did it work like that in the Soviet Union?
Here is what actually happened:
1917 - The Revolution of the proletariet against the bourgoise.
1924 - Seven years later, the ideal communist state was supposed to start. But it
didn't. Instead more and more control was instituted. Reasons given:
"WWI/the White Russians are fighting us."
1931 - Seven years later, still no ideal state. Reasons given:
"We still have lots of enemies lurking about and also there is a Great
Depression going on."
1938 - Seven years later, still no ideal state. More control. Reasons given:
Hitler might invade us. We have to prepare."
1945 - Seven years later, still no ideal state. Lots fo control. Reasons given:
"Our country is devasted because of WWII and we have to rebuild."
1952 - 1987 - Five sets of seven years later, still no ideal state. Reasons given:
"We are in a cold war with the United States."
1987 - Finally the people saw the problem after 10 seven-year cycles (70 years). They had been lied to by their leaders.
I wonder what will happen when the Third Wave followers discover they've been lied to as a reason for the excessive control.
Wednesday, April 26, 2006
Something to Help Them Cope with Life
From Chuck Colson,
"One station cancelled my four-minute BreakPoint commentary saying that four minutes is the equivalent of one song. Horrors! Besides, the station manager allowed, BreakPoint is too serious and not contemporary enough. When another major station, this one in Cincinnati, replaced BreakPoint with music, I called the station manager, arguing that believers need to think Christianly about major worldview issues. The young woman on the other end of the phone admonished me: "But we don't want to do anything that will upset our listeners.
[emphasis mine]
'Younger women,' she said, want 'something to help them cope with life.' "
"One station cancelled my four-minute BreakPoint commentary saying that four minutes is the equivalent of one song. Horrors! Besides, the station manager allowed, BreakPoint is too serious and not contemporary enough. When another major station, this one in Cincinnati, replaced BreakPoint with music, I called the station manager, arguing that believers need to think Christianly about major worldview issues. The young woman on the other end of the phone admonished me: "But we don't want to do anything that will upset our listeners.
[emphasis mine]
'Younger women,' she said, want 'something to help them cope with life.' "
Monday, April 24, 2006
Nagaland
In the February 2006 issue of Christianity Today there is an article about a place in the far northwestern part of India called Nagaland. Edward and Mary Clarke brought the gospel here in 1872 and literally put their lives at stake. Nagaland natives were fierce animist headhunters, but the Clarkes got through to many of them, and today it's 60% Baptist Christian out of a population of 1.9 million. Here is what Christianity did for those who accepted Christ,
* They gave up headhunting and became more tolerant.
* They grew more responsible, dependable and prosperous while avoiding the dangers
of materialism.
* In the last 16 years they've become missions-minded by sending out 10,000
missionaries to neighboring countries and then to the whole world just like Jesus
said to do in Acts 1:8.
Nagaland shares boundaries or close proximity to Myanmar (former Burma), Buttan, Nepal, Bangladesh and western China, countries that are difficlut to evangelize. So, the Christians of Nagaland can get into these countries where perhaps missionaries from the West cannot.
Wati Aier of Oriental Theological Seminary puts the Nagaland Christians' progress over the years this way:
"Christianity didn't make us saints overnight. We struggle as everybody struggles in the world. The challenge is to live out the true Christian life in historical context."
Sounds to me as if the Western evanelical churches could learn a thing or two from the Christians of Nagaland. Perhaps we need to ditch the "change them through laws" approach and get back to good old fashioned evangelism with a touch of reaching the postmodern generation.
* They gave up headhunting and became more tolerant.
* They grew more responsible, dependable and prosperous while avoiding the dangers
of materialism.
* In the last 16 years they've become missions-minded by sending out 10,000
missionaries to neighboring countries and then to the whole world just like Jesus
said to do in Acts 1:8.
Nagaland shares boundaries or close proximity to Myanmar (former Burma), Buttan, Nepal, Bangladesh and western China, countries that are difficlut to evangelize. So, the Christians of Nagaland can get into these countries where perhaps missionaries from the West cannot.
Wati Aier of Oriental Theological Seminary puts the Nagaland Christians' progress over the years this way:
"Christianity didn't make us saints overnight. We struggle as everybody struggles in the world. The challenge is to live out the true Christian life in historical context."
Sounds to me as if the Western evanelical churches could learn a thing or two from the Christians of Nagaland. Perhaps we need to ditch the "change them through laws" approach and get back to good old fashioned evangelism with a touch of reaching the postmodern generation.
Sunday, April 23, 2006
If It Looks Like a Liberal Protestant...Maybe It Is
...fidelity to doctrine and God's Word - was now considered an expression of hatred. That which they believed to be the eternal Truth was now dismissed as ignorance.
No, that isn't a description of the emergents' rejection of traditional Scriptural interpretation and/or doctrine. It's the liberal Protestant's rejection of it. Specifically, it's a description of what's happened recently in the ECUSA (Episcopal Church in America). The same view is also prominent in the PCUSA (Presbyterian), UMC (United Methodist), ELCA (Lutheran) and sadly, more recently, the American Baptist Church.
So, then, the question on the docket is:
Are many of the main emergent voices really liberal Protestants in disguise?
*Source: Exodus: Why Americans are Fleeing Liberal Churches for Conservative Christianity by Dave Shiflett
No, that isn't a description of the emergents' rejection of traditional Scriptural interpretation and/or doctrine. It's the liberal Protestant's rejection of it. Specifically, it's a description of what's happened recently in the ECUSA (Episcopal Church in America). The same view is also prominent in the PCUSA (Presbyterian), UMC (United Methodist), ELCA (Lutheran) and sadly, more recently, the American Baptist Church.
So, then, the question on the docket is:
Are many of the main emergent voices really liberal Protestants in disguise?
*Source: Exodus: Why Americans are Fleeing Liberal Churches for Conservative Christianity by Dave Shiflett
Saturday, April 22, 2006
Quote of the Day
The trouble with all false evangelism is that it does not start with doctrine, it does not start by realizing man's condition. All fleshly, carnal, manmade evangelism is the result of inadequate understanding of what the apostle teaches us in the first ten verses of this second chapter of Ephesians.
1 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins,
2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.
3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath.
4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy,
5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.
6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--
9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
10 For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
--D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones
Source: http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/archives/2006/04/false_evangelis.php
1 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins,
2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.
3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath.
4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy,
5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.
6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus.
8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God--
9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
10 For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
--D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones
Source: http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/archives/2006/04/false_evangelis.php
Friday, April 21, 2006
Not Your Grandma's Church
Ian over at Raiders of the Lost Church has written a short but effective post entitled, Grandma Got Run over by a CCP.
His post segues into the theme we've been discussing here for the past few days.
His post segues into the theme we've been discussing here for the past few days.
Thursday, April 20, 2006
The Generations
Yesterday we saw China's draconian solution for adult children not visiting regularly or taking care of their parents.
In James 5, verse 27, it says,
Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction...
Here in the United States we are tending to see the Baby Boomers putting parents into convalescent hospitals. In previous days, this would be unknown, mainly because these places didn't really exist unless they were "poor houses" for those who had no one to take care of them and had no money to hire anyone. Why do they do this? Well, yes, families are smaller and women are working. But couldn't they work out some solution? I did. But I really do think this is part of a larger problem. There is and has been for the past 40 years a huge generational war in this nation (USA). And, this war has spilled over into the church
WWII Generation (70+)
| Gap Generation (62-69)
Baby Boomer Generation (42-60) |
| Baby Busters (31-41)
Generation X (Postmoderns - 18-30) |
Generation Y (1 day-17)
Descendant Group 1
The WWII generation begat the Baby Boomers. The Baby Boomers turned as a group to rebellion against their parents in the 1960's (but not everyone in that generation) . This infiltrated the church. Now, the Boomers' spawn, Generation X, is doing what their parents did...rebelling, athough passively and quietly. In the church this is showing up as non-attendance.
Descendant Group 2
Meanwhile, there was another descendant grouping. The Gap'ers, which are the smallest generation of the 20th century, were confused. The older ones tended to align with the WWII'ers while the younger ones tended to align with the Boomers. However, some older Boomers and younger Gap'ers were more aligned with the WWII'ers. The Gap'ers begat the Baby Busters who were more conservative (like their parents) as we saw in the late 1980's-1990's when these came of age to join business. Remember "dress for success?" Their children are the Generation Y and in about 10-15 years we shall see what they are like as adults - especially in the church - if they are there at all.
OK, now all of that said, here goes today's post theme. Rebellion. Rebellion in the society. Rebellion in the church. Most of this is a backlash of rebellion of the Boomers against their parents. Sadly, the other generations are caught in the middle this war. In the church, I am pretty convinced that the worship wars really don't have to do with music as much as this rebellion. And now sadly, Generation X is taking up their parents' mantle in rebellion against them because they (and every other generation) are rather sick of the Boomers' antics.
For years now on this post I've talked, warned and cajoled about the heresies coming into the church. If you listen to the seekers, emergents and Third Wavers, sometimes this is what you will hear:
"This isn't your father's church."
My point exactly.
It's the spirit in which this is said that bothers me at times. The Boomers as a group said essentially, "anything goes." And now in the evangelical church we see this being played out through loose and at times aberrant theologies; "Christian" rock and rap music; unBiblical organizational structures; fuzzy moral and theological boundaries; and, man's methods instead of God's holy methods being employed.
And who are doing these things? Most of the evangelical church leaders, or in the case of the emergents, the leaders' mentors, are in their late 40's to early 60's. A few are 70+. Hmmm. Now what generation would that be for the most part?
I rest my case.
In James 5, verse 27, it says,
Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction...
Here in the United States we are tending to see the Baby Boomers putting parents into convalescent hospitals. In previous days, this would be unknown, mainly because these places didn't really exist unless they were "poor houses" for those who had no one to take care of them and had no money to hire anyone. Why do they do this? Well, yes, families are smaller and women are working. But couldn't they work out some solution? I did. But I really do think this is part of a larger problem. There is and has been for the past 40 years a huge generational war in this nation (USA). And, this war has spilled over into the church
WWII Generation (70+)
| Gap Generation (62-69)
Baby Boomer Generation (42-60) |
| Baby Busters (31-41)
Generation X (Postmoderns - 18-30) |
Generation Y (1 day-17)
Descendant Group 1
The WWII generation begat the Baby Boomers. The Baby Boomers turned as a group to rebellion against their parents in the 1960's (but not everyone in that generation) . This infiltrated the church. Now, the Boomers' spawn, Generation X, is doing what their parents did...rebelling, athough passively and quietly. In the church this is showing up as non-attendance.
Descendant Group 2
Meanwhile, there was another descendant grouping. The Gap'ers, which are the smallest generation of the 20th century, were confused. The older ones tended to align with the WWII'ers while the younger ones tended to align with the Boomers. However, some older Boomers and younger Gap'ers were more aligned with the WWII'ers. The Gap'ers begat the Baby Busters who were more conservative (like their parents) as we saw in the late 1980's-1990's when these came of age to join business. Remember "dress for success?" Their children are the Generation Y and in about 10-15 years we shall see what they are like as adults - especially in the church - if they are there at all.
OK, now all of that said, here goes today's post theme. Rebellion. Rebellion in the society. Rebellion in the church. Most of this is a backlash of rebellion of the Boomers against their parents. Sadly, the other generations are caught in the middle this war. In the church, I am pretty convinced that the worship wars really don't have to do with music as much as this rebellion. And now sadly, Generation X is taking up their parents' mantle in rebellion against them because they (and every other generation) are rather sick of the Boomers' antics.
For years now on this post I've talked, warned and cajoled about the heresies coming into the church. If you listen to the seekers, emergents and Third Wavers, sometimes this is what you will hear:
"This isn't your father's church."
My point exactly.
It's the spirit in which this is said that bothers me at times. The Boomers as a group said essentially, "anything goes." And now in the evangelical church we see this being played out through loose and at times aberrant theologies; "Christian" rock and rap music; unBiblical organizational structures; fuzzy moral and theological boundaries; and, man's methods instead of God's holy methods being employed.
And who are doing these things? Most of the evangelical church leaders, or in the case of the emergents, the leaders' mentors, are in their late 40's to early 60's. A few are 70+. Hmmm. Now what generation would that be for the most part?
I rest my case.
Wednesday, April 19, 2006
Take Care of Your Parents - Or Else! (Chinese Style)
In my Saturday Los Angeles Times, I read about how China is resolving its elderly problems . If adult children don't take care of their parent, they might be jailed. And if they don't visit them at least once a week, they'll get fined. If it isn't resolved and they continue not to visit them, then you going to jail. Five (5) years in jail for some of the slackers.
Meanwhile, here in North America, we are still throwing our parents into convalescent homes.
This post is a prelude and will prepare us for tomorrow which will be one of the most important posts I've written.
Meanwhile, here in North America, we are still throwing our parents into convalescent homes.
This post is a prelude and will prepare us for tomorrow which will be one of the most important posts I've written.
Tuesday, April 18, 2006
If It's Spring....It Must Be TBN Telethon Time
Bob over at Totem to Temple says that TBN's Raise-a-Ton is on again. No, that isn't a typo.
How should a Christian network raise money? I'm not aware that CBN holds these telethons...am I right? Why can't the Praise the Lord program, which is TBN's flagship one, simply tell people at the end of the program - or perhaps even in the middle - to send money if the program blesses them. Period. Takes 60 seconds. I really don't understand these TBN telethons. Does anyone really watch them? I guess somebody must as they keep holding them year after year after year. So, they must be getting a lot of money (or a ton of money as Bob says) during these times. Anyway, I think next Monday TBN will be back to normal. Well, that is if you call their regular programming normal.
How should a Christian network raise money? I'm not aware that CBN holds these telethons...am I right? Why can't the Praise the Lord program, which is TBN's flagship one, simply tell people at the end of the program - or perhaps even in the middle - to send money if the program blesses them. Period. Takes 60 seconds. I really don't understand these TBN telethons. Does anyone really watch them? I guess somebody must as they keep holding them year after year after year. So, they must be getting a lot of money (or a ton of money as Bob says) during these times. Anyway, I think next Monday TBN will be back to normal. Well, that is if you call their regular programming normal.
Monday, April 17, 2006
The Pathway from Liberal Protestantism to Emergent
...fidelity to doctrine and God's Word - was now considered an expression of hatred. That which they believed to be the eternal Truth was now dismissed as ignorance.
No, that isn't a description of the emergents' rejection of traditional Scriptural interpretation/doctrine. It's the liberal Protestant's rejection of it. Specifically, it's a description of what's happened recently in the ECUSA (Episcopal Church in America). The same view is also prominent in the PCUSA (Presbyterian), UMC (United Methodist), ELCA (Lutheran) and sadly, more recently, the American Baptist Church.
Are many of the main emergent voices really liberal Protestants in disguise?
*Source: Exodus: Why Americans are Fleeing Liberal Churches for Conservative Christianity by Dave Shiflett
No, that isn't a description of the emergents' rejection of traditional Scriptural interpretation/doctrine. It's the liberal Protestant's rejection of it. Specifically, it's a description of what's happened recently in the ECUSA (Episcopal Church in America). The same view is also prominent in the PCUSA (Presbyterian), UMC (United Methodist), ELCA (Lutheran) and sadly, more recently, the American Baptist Church.
Are many of the main emergent voices really liberal Protestants in disguise?
*Source: Exodus: Why Americans are Fleeing Liberal Churches for Conservative Christianity by Dave Shiflett
Saturday, April 15, 2006
From Passover....(blank)...to Pentecost
I've said many times here that one of the myriad problems I have with the Third Wave revivalists/prophets/apostles/etc. is their lack of focus or even mention of Christ and what He did at the cross. I've also pondered here at Crossroads how people in those churches can become Christians as they need to hear about Christ who IS the center of the gospel. How can they respond and be saved? (see Romans 10:9,10. Paul asked the same questione )
But I digress a bit. Lately, and this happens ever so often in the Third Wave world, scads of prophecies have come out of their camps lately about the need to observe and take seriously the Passover feast. And of course as usual with this group, it's also time for another 28 days of prayer and fasting. I keep waiting for one of them to get to Good Friday and then Easter. But there is a blank there in their prophetic calendar. In fact, I thought with the emphasis on Passover there might even be a mention of the Last Supper - but No. The emphasis, as always, is on the Judaic view. NO, I'm not an anti-Semite, but I do think we need to make a distinction between the two faiths. Jesus is the reason for Easter for Christians. Maybe we should talk about Him?
After Easter, we will probably hear about Pentecost as that is the next calendar date for the Third Wavers. They like Pentecost because it involves the Holy Spirit...or what they think is the Holy Spirit. But, in between there is a huge BLANK!
Attention Third Wave Charismatics: It's called Good Friday and Easter. It's when Christ died, taking upon Himself our iniquities (sins) and sicknesses (diseases and infirmities). It's when He made it possible for us to be accepted and adopted into God's family and sons and daughters. But in order to take advantage of this wonderful gift, which is accepted purely through faith, we need to repent of our iniquity and then believe on His name and what He did for us at the cross.
And that---is the reason for the season.
Happy Easter everybody...:)
But I digress a bit. Lately, and this happens ever so often in the Third Wave world, scads of prophecies have come out of their camps lately about the need to observe and take seriously the Passover feast. And of course as usual with this group, it's also time for another 28 days of prayer and fasting. I keep waiting for one of them to get to Good Friday and then Easter. But there is a blank there in their prophetic calendar. In fact, I thought with the emphasis on Passover there might even be a mention of the Last Supper - but No. The emphasis, as always, is on the Judaic view. NO, I'm not an anti-Semite, but I do think we need to make a distinction between the two faiths. Jesus is the reason for Easter for Christians. Maybe we should talk about Him?
After Easter, we will probably hear about Pentecost as that is the next calendar date for the Third Wavers. They like Pentecost because it involves the Holy Spirit...or what they think is the Holy Spirit. But, in between there is a huge BLANK!
Attention Third Wave Charismatics: It's called Good Friday and Easter. It's when Christ died, taking upon Himself our iniquities (sins) and sicknesses (diseases and infirmities). It's when He made it possible for us to be accepted and adopted into God's family and sons and daughters. But in order to take advantage of this wonderful gift, which is accepted purely through faith, we need to repent of our iniquity and then believe on His name and what He did for us at the cross.
And that---is the reason for the season.
Happy Easter everybody...:)
Friday, April 14, 2006
What Would Happen if......
What would happen if our churches adopted the first century organizational structure? No more hearing about a "new paradigm;" no more hearing about how "God is doing a new thing." Here is how our churches would look if this first century model was adopted. At this writing, I don't know any evangelical denomination/ministry/church that does this, do you?
Our first century model church would be run by elders. The pastor would either be one of the elders, selected by the elders; or, a highly spiritual person recommended by a church in another city. If the church was newly established by an apostle of another church, it would be run by him/them until mature elders could be raised up from within it.
The pastor-teacher would not be teaching 48 weeks a year (2 weeks vacation; 2 weeks for a guest speaker and/or missionary week). There would be other teachers and prophets teaching many weeks. Some of these would be teaching elders, and teachers and prophets from within the church. Others would be visiting speakers - teachers and prophets and apostles. Elders would mainly be selected by other elders, or if there was an apostle/church over our model church, they would select them.
There would be no talk of a "special anointed" person being the head of the church and the congregation "catching his vision." The vision would be communicated by God to the elders; the elders to the congregants.
In our model church, deacons would be selected by the elders to minister to the sick (helping them heal, seeing they get care), while the elders would be the ones praying for the sick to get well per James 5:13-15,
Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
The deacons would also be seeing to the needs of the poorer ones in the congregation, giving money or food to them, and especially looking after the widows and oprhaned chidldren (single adults would also fall within this category if they had no one to take care of them).
The elders would pray and counsel members of the congregation who requested it. Of course both elders and deacons; prophets and teachers had to be very mature both in spirit and in emotion.
Perhaps more people would have more balanced teaching, feel more taken care of, have less control and abuse, and get more out of church. This in turn would attract more non-believers.
Sounds like a pretty good church to me.
Our first century model church would be run by elders. The pastor would either be one of the elders, selected by the elders; or, a highly spiritual person recommended by a church in another city. If the church was newly established by an apostle of another church, it would be run by him/them until mature elders could be raised up from within it.
The pastor-teacher would not be teaching 48 weeks a year (2 weeks vacation; 2 weeks for a guest speaker and/or missionary week). There would be other teachers and prophets teaching many weeks. Some of these would be teaching elders, and teachers and prophets from within the church. Others would be visiting speakers - teachers and prophets and apostles. Elders would mainly be selected by other elders, or if there was an apostle/church over our model church, they would select them.
There would be no talk of a "special anointed" person being the head of the church and the congregation "catching his vision." The vision would be communicated by God to the elders; the elders to the congregants.
In our model church, deacons would be selected by the elders to minister to the sick (helping them heal, seeing they get care), while the elders would be the ones praying for the sick to get well per James 5:13-15,
Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
The deacons would also be seeing to the needs of the poorer ones in the congregation, giving money or food to them, and especially looking after the widows and oprhaned chidldren (single adults would also fall within this category if they had no one to take care of them).
The elders would pray and counsel members of the congregation who requested it. Of course both elders and deacons; prophets and teachers had to be very mature both in spirit and in emotion.
Perhaps more people would have more balanced teaching, feel more taken care of, have less control and abuse, and get more out of church. This in turn would attract more non-believers.
Sounds like a pretty good church to me.
Thursday, April 13, 2006
Am I an Old Fogey?
I'm a bit confused. I thought coming on sexually to someone was not a good thing in God's eyes. And I thought violence as a spectator sport where people get their body parts smashed was probably not a good thing in God's sight either.
I guess I'm mistaken. Some of the emergent leaders (including Mark Driscoll...which saddens me) and others in other movements think it was fine for a lap dancer to do a lap dance on a customer (a paying customer) while witnessing to him about Christ. I guess just color me...dumb.
And Driscoll also thinks it's fine to watch what is called Mixed Martial Arts. It's also called Ultimate Fighting. This is a sport where you knock your opponent slly without much protection. Because Driscoll doesn't wish his three young sons to think Christian men are soft and swishy, he has them watching this stuff too. I am very disappointed in Driscoll but not surprised. This generation of Christan leaders as a group tend to be confused and blurred about moral boundaries. Perhaps they should get into the New Testament more. The scary thing is....what will their sons be like when they become the new generation of evangelical leaders?
...but then I read people like Tim Challies, Tim Wirth and others of that generation and think...perhaps there is hope after all.
http://theresurgence.com/
I guess I'm mistaken. Some of the emergent leaders (including Mark Driscoll...which saddens me) and others in other movements think it was fine for a lap dancer to do a lap dance on a customer (a paying customer) while witnessing to him about Christ. I guess just color me...dumb.
And Driscoll also thinks it's fine to watch what is called Mixed Martial Arts. It's also called Ultimate Fighting. This is a sport where you knock your opponent slly without much protection. Because Driscoll doesn't wish his three young sons to think Christian men are soft and swishy, he has them watching this stuff too. I am very disappointed in Driscoll but not surprised. This generation of Christan leaders as a group tend to be confused and blurred about moral boundaries. Perhaps they should get into the New Testament more. The scary thing is....what will their sons be like when they become the new generation of evangelical leaders?
...but then I read people like Tim Challies, Tim Wirth and others of that generation and think...perhaps there is hope after all.
http://theresurgence.com/
Monday, April 10, 2006
The Outright Contempt of the Emergents
Tim Challies has a great post today (Boldness is Our Birthright). He correctly identifies what the emergent McClaren crowd (not to be confused with Driscol and Keller) is essentially all about.
As others have observed, the real enemy of the Emerging Church is conservative, biblical Protestantism. McLaren will commend anything or anybody, it seems, except those who have a faith built upon the truths revealed in the New Testament epistles.
McLaren mentioned at one point how many times he has studied and read the gospels since he professed Christ many years ago. But when he spoke of the book of Romans, he did so without the same reverence. When I examined the evening and pieced it together with what McLaren has revealed of himself in his books I was led to conclude something that startled me. Brian McLaren loves the red letters of the Bible, but hates the black. The red letters so easily support the type of Christianity he is attempting to build and promote, but the black interfere.
Tim points out that true Christianity is a bold faith - one where we can come to God confidently when we are born again and adopted into His family.
But sadly, the Emergent one, is not, as Tim writes after hearing McClaren in person,
Throughout the evening, boldness was absent. The faith of the emergents, the postmodern faith, is a faith that is devoid of boldness before God. It is timid, angry, tentative, questioning. It is not a faith of assurance and boldness. It emphasizes the unknowability of God more than what God has revealed to us about Himself. The faith McLaren commends is a faith that always questions, always doubts. It seems that the only faith McLaren hates is the faith of a person who knows what he believes and is convicted by Scripture and by plain reason that what God has revealed is truth--true truth.
....Confidence is our privilege, boldness our birthright. We can know God and we can have confidence in what we know, as long as it accords with the words of Scripture--not merely the red words, but the black words too.
As others have observed, the real enemy of the Emerging Church is conservative, biblical Protestantism. McLaren will commend anything or anybody, it seems, except those who have a faith built upon the truths revealed in the New Testament epistles.
McLaren mentioned at one point how many times he has studied and read the gospels since he professed Christ many years ago. But when he spoke of the book of Romans, he did so without the same reverence. When I examined the evening and pieced it together with what McLaren has revealed of himself in his books I was led to conclude something that startled me. Brian McLaren loves the red letters of the Bible, but hates the black. The red letters so easily support the type of Christianity he is attempting to build and promote, but the black interfere.
Tim points out that true Christianity is a bold faith - one where we can come to God confidently when we are born again and adopted into His family.
But sadly, the Emergent one, is not, as Tim writes after hearing McClaren in person,
Throughout the evening, boldness was absent. The faith of the emergents, the postmodern faith, is a faith that is devoid of boldness before God. It is timid, angry, tentative, questioning. It is not a faith of assurance and boldness. It emphasizes the unknowability of God more than what God has revealed to us about Himself. The faith McLaren commends is a faith that always questions, always doubts. It seems that the only faith McLaren hates is the faith of a person who knows what he believes and is convicted by Scripture and by plain reason that what God has revealed is truth--true truth.
....Confidence is our privilege, boldness our birthright. We can know God and we can have confidence in what we know, as long as it accords with the words of Scripture--not merely the red words, but the black words too.
Saturday, April 08, 2006
Quote of the Day
"Our churches ought to have large signs on the front that say,
'We Teach All Who Seriously Commit Themselves to Jesus How to Do Everything He Said to Do.' "
---Dallas Willard in the Divine Conspiracy
'We Teach All Who Seriously Commit Themselves to Jesus How to Do Everything He Said to Do.' "
---Dallas Willard in the Divine Conspiracy
Friday, April 07, 2006
Things Jesus said to NEVER do
Although I have some reservations about Doug Perry, there is one area he keeps needling us in - the prosperity and ease of Christians and churches at the expense of the poor both here and elsewhere. Here is another article from him with a slant towards how we are NOT to carry out the Great Commission.
Here are some things that Jesus NEVER said to do:
*Go into all the world and build big buildings.
*Go into all the world and entertain the Christians.
*Go divide up into factions and constantly argue with each other.
*Go find people you can pay to go into all the world so you don't have to tell anyone yourself.
*Go into all the world that's easy to get to and will let you in without too much hassle.
*Go and elevate certain men above all the others and listen to them more than you listen to Me.
*Go into all the world and see what you can learn from them about how to influence people.
*Go get an education so you'll be thoroughly prepared by the theories and programs of Man before you go do what Jesus commanded.
*Go into all the world and learn to be just like them.
*Go into all the world and ignore all the poor people, recruit all the rich people, and then spend 95% of all the revenue on yourself and your own comforts.
Here are some things that Jesus NEVER said to do:
*Go into all the world and build big buildings.
*Go into all the world and entertain the Christians.
*Go divide up into factions and constantly argue with each other.
*Go find people you can pay to go into all the world so you don't have to tell anyone yourself.
*Go into all the world that's easy to get to and will let you in without too much hassle.
*Go and elevate certain men above all the others and listen to them more than you listen to Me.
*Go into all the world and see what you can learn from them about how to influence people.
*Go get an education so you'll be thoroughly prepared by the theories and programs of Man before you go do what Jesus commanded.
*Go into all the world and learn to be just like them.
*Go into all the world and ignore all the poor people, recruit all the rich people, and then spend 95% of all the revenue on yourself and your own comforts.
Tuesday, April 04, 2006
The Samuel Company
Once again, great stuff from David Wilkerson,
In thousands of churches now, there is never any mention of sin, the Cross, sacrifice, judgement or hell. Godly watchmen aren't allowed to speak, and there is no stirring of hearts. Instead, the whole focus is on success, with every sermon designed to make people feel good. It's all resulting in apathy, greed, self-centeredness, coldness of heart. And it's causing pain to godly believers everywhere, as they see God's name brought to disgrace.....
.....the Lord has a Samuel Company in this generation. He's raising them up out of the ruins of a greedy chruch and is calling them to himself. I meet members of this invisible Samuel Company all over the world. They hear clearly from the Lord, and they're not afraid to bring a word to warn His church. Moreover, God has multitudes of hidden, unknown prophets, and they're being trained in the school of hardship. They're part of the Samuel Company and they know what's coming, because the Lord has told them. In spite of coming judgments, these godly ones are full of hope and rejoicing, becuse they see a new day coming.
[Note: he is NOT talking about the Third Wave churches or prophets here].
Source: World Challenge Pulpit Series - February 27, 2006 issue
In thousands of churches now, there is never any mention of sin, the Cross, sacrifice, judgement or hell. Godly watchmen aren't allowed to speak, and there is no stirring of hearts. Instead, the whole focus is on success, with every sermon designed to make people feel good. It's all resulting in apathy, greed, self-centeredness, coldness of heart. And it's causing pain to godly believers everywhere, as they see God's name brought to disgrace.....
.....the Lord has a Samuel Company in this generation. He's raising them up out of the ruins of a greedy chruch and is calling them to himself. I meet members of this invisible Samuel Company all over the world. They hear clearly from the Lord, and they're not afraid to bring a word to warn His church. Moreover, God has multitudes of hidden, unknown prophets, and they're being trained in the school of hardship. They're part of the Samuel Company and they know what's coming, because the Lord has told them. In spite of coming judgments, these godly ones are full of hope and rejoicing, becuse they see a new day coming.
[Note: he is NOT talking about the Third Wave churches or prophets here].
Source: World Challenge Pulpit Series - February 27, 2006 issue
Monday, April 03, 2006
Kingdom Now/Latter Rain and the AG
I received an email about the Kingdom Now theology that was taken from Discernment Ministries Newsletter. The article, by Jewel Grewe, gave a thumbnail history of the Latter Rain teaching/controversy of the late 1940's and then how it was picked up by some of the Charismatics of the 1970's, especially the CGM group (the Shepherding folks). Then she showed how this teaching has invaded once again, this time into the Third Wave Charismatic movement.
I have an interesting perspective on this from two fronts in which I was involved in approximately from 1999-2003. The first was an email discussion group which dealt with contemporary Pentecostal issues. Almost all of the participants were Assembly of God pastors. One of the members of the group was the esteemed (and I found out from the article lately deceased) Opal Reddin, professor at the AG Central Bible College. I felt very fortunate to be a part of this group and saw the frustration from most of them over the Pensacola (and Toronto, etc) "revival." Brownsville in Pensacola is an Assembly of God church and so that why they were concerned with what was happening there. Most of the pastors on the list could see the deceptions described in the Grewe article. In fact, here is a quote from that article. Some of the pastors on the list were saying similar thigns.
A former member of the Brownsville Assembly of God in Pensacola, Florida explains that, “it seemed as if most of the people I knew very well, began to realize that the promise of ‘there must be more’ wasn’t happening as promised. Also gimmicks and false prophecies obviously didn’t pan out as well. What happened was that people got messed up…the end effect it had was to ‘ruin’ people for the simplicity of the gospel and ‘normal’ church life.” These had once been solid people and they became “spiritual gypsies” unable to find a church home. He then made a startling comment: “You would be amazed at how many Brownsvillians don’t attend any church regularly right now.
I could have also written that myself because of the second place I was involved with during those years. Destiny Image Publishers (a Third Revival publisher) opened up a chat room for mainly Brownsville people. I was in that room for three years. And believe me, it was god-awful. The reason I say this is because of the fantasy world these people were in. It was obvious that so many were very dysfunctional, and instead of helping them Biblically, Brownsville and other revival churches were just feeding them more fantasy. I knew that within a couple of years most of these people would reach critical mass and begin to drop out of revival churches like flies. Others would find a more gospel preaching Pentecostal or Charismatic church. Others would probably disdain the Charismatic church for a more non-C/P one. Others would just drop out altogether. And then there wouldl be that few who would keep up the pace of legalism the Third Wave offers - constant fasting and prayer, "radical worship," seeking God in mystical ways, flying around the country to hear and be prayed for by the "anointed" ones, and so forth.
And now back to the Contemporary Pentecostal Issues email list......one of the pastors was so fed up with this that he and some other pastors crafted a resolution to be presented at the 2000 meeting of all the AG pastors. That year it was held in Orlando...and guess who the keynote speaker was. Steve Hill. The same Steve Hill who "started" the revival at Brownville Assembly of God in Pensacola, FL. That was the last straw for these pastors. They felt some of their leadership was selling them out.They simply wanted to reassert what their denomination passed in 1949 - a stance against the Latter Rain teachings.
It was no surprise when the resolution, named Resolution 16 was tabled. Thankfully, later, it was adopted with some revision. But the main parts of it were still intact. You can read Resolution 16 at the AG website. It goes into a refutation of the Latter Rain teaching in their churches. Sadly, there are still many AG churches that are knee-deep into this, noticeably the AG chruch in Redding, CA as well of course, Brownsville in Pensacola, FL.
And now back to the Grewe article for a moment......she points out that the seeker-sensitives (read that Rick Warren) are into some of the Kingdom Now (read that latter rain). Emphasis however would be on the word some. Since most of these churches are not C/P's, they aren't [yet] into the apostles and prophet stream. I have said repeatedly here that in a few years, please do not be surprised to see the Third Wavers, seeker-sensitives and emergents combine into one huge apostate church. And then....there will be the rest of us cross-centered, Christ-centered, Bible centered Christians --- the Remnant. And guess who I think will be persecuting us. I'm sure you can see where I am going with this. And believe me, I am not one of these people who thinks there are conspiracies all over the place. So I believe this comes out of a fairly mature outlook on my part.
To end this post, I want to quote the Grewe article as she quoted Opal Reddin's warning just before her death. This truly IMO is a prophetic word for the church:
Opal said,
“As you have opportunity, please tell any and of our all of our A/G churches that I for one see Rick Warren and his deceptive "Purpose Driven books and practices" to be the gradual downfall to each church becoming involved. Some of my reasons:
1. His SHAPE, Jung-oriented spiritual gifts tests destroy the very meaning of "spiritual gifts, and hence all Pentecostal churches will become redundant." Those taking them as having any degree of value will find (too late) they were grieving the Holy Spirit. This is one of the main hindrances today to people receiving the baptism in the Holy Spirit.
2. His "Gospel" excludes repentance as a necessary step toward salvation, and it IS necessary, according to Jesus. Warren's "Gospel" is "another gospel" of works," No wonder the Catholics and homosexuals feel at home in his pastor's conferences!
3. Every one who signs the covenant of membership is in the process of disobeying our Lord's commands to swear not.
4. Every A/G minister and memory should read Who's Driving the Purpose Driven Church? by James Sundquist and Deceived on Purpose by Warren Smith.
For these and other well-considered reasons, I plead with every A/G church and member to avoid Rick Warren's beliefs and practices in every way possible. We must get back to the things that brought the manifest presence of God into our midst, when gifts of the Spirit convinced unbelievers of their need to repent and get right with God. The Full Gospel will still bring sinners to salvation, and saints to full obedience as we anticipate our Lord's return in Glory."
Grewe then comments:
Opal understood the “Kingdom Agenda” of the Purpose Driven Church and all of the ramifications. Her heart was broken at the thought that so many that she loved were rushing headlong into this deception.
Then Grewe contrasts what a real church looks like in her denomination, AOG.
On a positive note, I was blessed several weeks ago to visit an Assembly of God church in Nashville, Tennessee and find the people on their knees at the altar repenting and calling upon the Lord. I immediately felt at “home” because I sensed the moving of the Spirit and knew that the Lord was well pleased.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Now the surprise ending to this post. I actually do believe in much of the latter rain teaching BUT not the kingdom Now extreme, the definition that some are giving to apostles, and that horrid Manifest Sons of God teaching. But, I do beleive it is incumbent on each of us to follow God's leading in our lives to bring as much of heaven to earth as possible WITHOUT compromising the Word and without manipulation or making our mantra "the end justifies the means." That is never God's way. Jesus gave us a model prayer and in it He said,
.....Thy kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven.....
I also believe in apostles and prophets FOR TODAY...BUT not what passes for these in the Third Wave. As I've said before here, the true revival of the future will be a quiet, non-bragging one. There will be no deliverance churches, healing churches, Holy Spirit churches, revival churches, and so forth. There will just be the churches - centered around the Trinity and Christ and the cross.
The prophets will have 100% accuracy - not the 60-70% of the Third Wave prophets; apostles will be people in unreached lands - not people trying to get over already established churches without many signs and wonders to establish them as true apostles. Healings and miracles and prophetic words will be quiet, and ordinary in a sense, completely centered around what Jesus did for us at the cross and at the Resurrection.
If you see this rejoice. If you see more of this-in-your-face, exxagerated, and at times, lying, fantasy, Third Wave-type church---then run, run for your life!!
I have an interesting perspective on this from two fronts in which I was involved in approximately from 1999-2003. The first was an email discussion group which dealt with contemporary Pentecostal issues. Almost all of the participants were Assembly of God pastors. One of the members of the group was the esteemed (and I found out from the article lately deceased) Opal Reddin, professor at the AG Central Bible College. I felt very fortunate to be a part of this group and saw the frustration from most of them over the Pensacola (and Toronto, etc) "revival." Brownsville in Pensacola is an Assembly of God church and so that why they were concerned with what was happening there. Most of the pastors on the list could see the deceptions described in the Grewe article. In fact, here is a quote from that article. Some of the pastors on the list were saying similar thigns.
A former member of the Brownsville Assembly of God in Pensacola, Florida explains that, “it seemed as if most of the people I knew very well, began to realize that the promise of ‘there must be more’ wasn’t happening as promised. Also gimmicks and false prophecies obviously didn’t pan out as well. What happened was that people got messed up…the end effect it had was to ‘ruin’ people for the simplicity of the gospel and ‘normal’ church life.” These had once been solid people and they became “spiritual gypsies” unable to find a church home. He then made a startling comment: “You would be amazed at how many Brownsvillians don’t attend any church regularly right now.
I could have also written that myself because of the second place I was involved with during those years. Destiny Image Publishers (a Third Revival publisher) opened up a chat room for mainly Brownsville people. I was in that room for three years. And believe me, it was god-awful. The reason I say this is because of the fantasy world these people were in. It was obvious that so many were very dysfunctional, and instead of helping them Biblically, Brownsville and other revival churches were just feeding them more fantasy. I knew that within a couple of years most of these people would reach critical mass and begin to drop out of revival churches like flies. Others would find a more gospel preaching Pentecostal or Charismatic church. Others would probably disdain the Charismatic church for a more non-C/P one. Others would just drop out altogether. And then there wouldl be that few who would keep up the pace of legalism the Third Wave offers - constant fasting and prayer, "radical worship," seeking God in mystical ways, flying around the country to hear and be prayed for by the "anointed" ones, and so forth.
And now back to the Contemporary Pentecostal Issues email list......one of the pastors was so fed up with this that he and some other pastors crafted a resolution to be presented at the 2000 meeting of all the AG pastors. That year it was held in Orlando...and guess who the keynote speaker was. Steve Hill. The same Steve Hill who "started" the revival at Brownville Assembly of God in Pensacola, FL. That was the last straw for these pastors. They felt some of their leadership was selling them out.They simply wanted to reassert what their denomination passed in 1949 - a stance against the Latter Rain teachings.
It was no surprise when the resolution, named Resolution 16 was tabled. Thankfully, later, it was adopted with some revision. But the main parts of it were still intact. You can read Resolution 16 at the AG website. It goes into a refutation of the Latter Rain teaching in their churches. Sadly, there are still many AG churches that are knee-deep into this, noticeably the AG chruch in Redding, CA as well of course, Brownsville in Pensacola, FL.
And now back to the Grewe article for a moment......she points out that the seeker-sensitives (read that Rick Warren) are into some of the Kingdom Now (read that latter rain). Emphasis however would be on the word some. Since most of these churches are not C/P's, they aren't [yet] into the apostles and prophet stream. I have said repeatedly here that in a few years, please do not be surprised to see the Third Wavers, seeker-sensitives and emergents combine into one huge apostate church. And then....there will be the rest of us cross-centered, Christ-centered, Bible centered Christians --- the Remnant. And guess who I think will be persecuting us. I'm sure you can see where I am going with this. And believe me, I am not one of these people who thinks there are conspiracies all over the place. So I believe this comes out of a fairly mature outlook on my part.
To end this post, I want to quote the Grewe article as she quoted Opal Reddin's warning just before her death. This truly IMO is a prophetic word for the church:
Opal said,
“As you have opportunity, please tell any and of our all of our A/G churches that I for one see Rick Warren and his deceptive "Purpose Driven books and practices" to be the gradual downfall to each church becoming involved. Some of my reasons:
1. His SHAPE, Jung-oriented spiritual gifts tests destroy the very meaning of "spiritual gifts, and hence all Pentecostal churches will become redundant." Those taking them as having any degree of value will find (too late) they were grieving the Holy Spirit. This is one of the main hindrances today to people receiving the baptism in the Holy Spirit.
2. His "Gospel" excludes repentance as a necessary step toward salvation, and it IS necessary, according to Jesus. Warren's "Gospel" is "another gospel" of works," No wonder the Catholics and homosexuals feel at home in his pastor's conferences!
3. Every one who signs the covenant of membership is in the process of disobeying our Lord's commands to swear not.
4. Every A/G minister and memory should read Who's Driving the Purpose Driven Church? by James Sundquist and Deceived on Purpose by Warren Smith.
For these and other well-considered reasons, I plead with every A/G church and member to avoid Rick Warren's beliefs and practices in every way possible. We must get back to the things that brought the manifest presence of God into our midst, when gifts of the Spirit convinced unbelievers of their need to repent and get right with God. The Full Gospel will still bring sinners to salvation, and saints to full obedience as we anticipate our Lord's return in Glory."
Grewe then comments:
Opal understood the “Kingdom Agenda” of the Purpose Driven Church and all of the ramifications. Her heart was broken at the thought that so many that she loved were rushing headlong into this deception.
Then Grewe contrasts what a real church looks like in her denomination, AOG.
On a positive note, I was blessed several weeks ago to visit an Assembly of God church in Nashville, Tennessee and find the people on their knees at the altar repenting and calling upon the Lord. I immediately felt at “home” because I sensed the moving of the Spirit and knew that the Lord was well pleased.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Now the surprise ending to this post. I actually do believe in much of the latter rain teaching BUT not the kingdom Now extreme, the definition that some are giving to apostles, and that horrid Manifest Sons of God teaching. But, I do beleive it is incumbent on each of us to follow God's leading in our lives to bring as much of heaven to earth as possible WITHOUT compromising the Word and without manipulation or making our mantra "the end justifies the means." That is never God's way. Jesus gave us a model prayer and in it He said,
.....Thy kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven.....
I also believe in apostles and prophets FOR TODAY...BUT not what passes for these in the Third Wave. As I've said before here, the true revival of the future will be a quiet, non-bragging one. There will be no deliverance churches, healing churches, Holy Spirit churches, revival churches, and so forth. There will just be the churches - centered around the Trinity and Christ and the cross.
The prophets will have 100% accuracy - not the 60-70% of the Third Wave prophets; apostles will be people in unreached lands - not people trying to get over already established churches without many signs and wonders to establish them as true apostles. Healings and miracles and prophetic words will be quiet, and ordinary in a sense, completely centered around what Jesus did for us at the cross and at the Resurrection.
If you see this rejoice. If you see more of this-in-your-face, exxagerated, and at times, lying, fantasy, Third Wave-type church---then run, run for your life!!
Saturday, April 01, 2006
The Promise Driven Church vs. The Purpose Driven Church
The Nov-Dec 2005 issue of Modern Reformation Magazine was devoted to the Promise Driven Life as opposed to the Purpose Driven life. One of the articles was entitled "The Promise Driven Church."
After explaining how both Robert Schuller and Rick Warren canvassed their areas taking polls on what people wanted from a church, author Todd Wilken tells us the difference between the Purpose-Driven Church and the Promise Driven one.
The unchurch [PurposeDriven] offers the unchurched "life application" preaching. Why? This is what the unchurched expect. The unchurched always expect less than God gives. The unchurched expect preaching that gives them practical solutions to their everyday problems.
[But] the [Promise Driven Church] church has something better. To begin with the church doesn't preach to the unchurched. The church doesn't really care whether someone is churched, unchurched, underchurched, overchurched, mischurched, dischurched, prechurched, dechurched, or rechurched. The church preaches to sinners - sinners who are unchurched and sinners who aren't; sinners who are seeking and sinners who aren't; sinners who are unbeliever's and sinners who aren't.
He goes on to say what the Promise Driven Church should be teaching.
The world will never consider 'Christ crucified' relevant. The unchurched will never tell us that they WANT to hear the message of the cross. This is why the [Promise Driven] church doesn't ask people what they want to hear. the [Promise Driven] church preaches what people NEED to hear.
The unchurch offers the unchurched lots of things to do. They typical unchurch is a very busy place. Why? This is what the unchurched expect. The unchurch expect the church to be like any other volunteer organization. [But] the [Promise Driven] church has something better. The church isn't interested in giving sinners something to do. The church is interested in giving sinners the things God has done for them.
As I've said in the past here, I've noticed how so many movements today are watering down or even ignoring Christ's work at Calvary. Most of the Third Wave, seeker sensitive (Purpose-Driven), and emergent churches are all guilty of this.
So, I still am asking the question that Paul also asked in Romans 10:9-10. How can someone become a Christian (i.e. believe) if they haven't heard the gospel? And how can they hear if no one tells them? This is a very important question for all churches, pastors, elders and movements to really consider.
After explaining how both Robert Schuller and Rick Warren canvassed their areas taking polls on what people wanted from a church, author Todd Wilken tells us the difference between the Purpose-Driven Church and the Promise Driven one.
The unchurch [PurposeDriven] offers the unchurched "life application" preaching. Why? This is what the unchurched expect. The unchurched always expect less than God gives. The unchurched expect preaching that gives them practical solutions to their everyday problems.
[But] the [Promise Driven Church] church has something better. To begin with the church doesn't preach to the unchurched. The church doesn't really care whether someone is churched, unchurched, underchurched, overchurched, mischurched, dischurched, prechurched, dechurched, or rechurched. The church preaches to sinners - sinners who are unchurched and sinners who aren't; sinners who are seeking and sinners who aren't; sinners who are unbeliever's and sinners who aren't.
He goes on to say what the Promise Driven Church should be teaching.
The world will never consider 'Christ crucified' relevant. The unchurched will never tell us that they WANT to hear the message of the cross. This is why the [Promise Driven] church doesn't ask people what they want to hear. the [Promise Driven] church preaches what people NEED to hear.
The unchurch offers the unchurched lots of things to do. They typical unchurch is a very busy place. Why? This is what the unchurched expect. The unchurch expect the church to be like any other volunteer organization. [But] the [Promise Driven] church has something better. The church isn't interested in giving sinners something to do. The church is interested in giving sinners the things God has done for them.
As I've said in the past here, I've noticed how so many movements today are watering down or even ignoring Christ's work at Calvary. Most of the Third Wave, seeker sensitive (Purpose-Driven), and emergent churches are all guilty of this.
So, I still am asking the question that Paul also asked in Romans 10:9-10. How can someone become a Christian (i.e. believe) if they haven't heard the gospel? And how can they hear if no one tells them? This is a very important question for all churches, pastors, elders and movements to really consider.
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